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Post by b_Pooly on Feb 9, 2009 6:58:27 GMT -5
WASHINGTON - The treatment of circus elephants went on trial in a U.S court Wednesday with animal-rights groups accusing Ringling Bros. of violating the Endangered Species Act when it uses bullhooks and chains to control its performing pachyderms.
During opening statements, the two sides showed dueling videos that painted vastly different portraits of the animals' lives under the big top.
The American Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals, the Animal Welfare Institute and other activist groups say they will prove that Asian elephants are injured physically and emotionally by their treatment in the circus.
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The groups say long hours traveling to more than 40 cities a year by train harms the highly social and intelligent animals, and they want Ringling Bros. to stop using them in their shows.
Ringling Bros. and Barnum & Bailey Circus and its parent company, Feld Entertainment, say the activists are just philosophically opposed to animals living in captivity and want to destroy a beloved American family tradition.
Defense lawyer John Simpson said the circus is nothing without its elephants, and the tools are needed for safety and are not harmful to the animals.
"For them to come in here and say they are not against the circus is like saying they aren't against baseball but the use of bats and balls," Simpson said. He said the circus would not shy from the dispute with animal-rights proponents, no matter what it costs. "As far as we're concerned, bring it on," Simpson said.
Differing accounts
"All right, the battle lines are drawn here," U.S. District Judge Emmet Sullivan said as he took the bench for the opening statements. He told both sides it is never too late to settle, drawing laughter from the two sides who have been arguing since the case was filed in 2000.
The two sides gave vastly different descriptions of the main training tool, which resembles a fireplace poker or cane with a metal tip curved down to a point.
Katherine Meyer, arguing for the animal-rights groups, showed a bullhook in court and said it's used to jab, prod and beat the elephants on a daily basis, resulting in puncture wounds, bloody lacerations and infections.
Simpson preferred the term "guide" when describing the instrument, which he said is used as an extension of the handler's arm to reach up to the animals. He pushed the hook into the palm of his hand and used it to scratch behind his ear and said even if it might be painful to a human, elephants are much larger animals with thicker skin.
He did not deny that the bullhook sometimes punctures the animals' skin, but said if that is prevented by the Endangered Species Act than so would shots, surgery and other veterinary practices.
Simpson argued that the circus' elephant breeding is helping propagate the species and "may well be their best defense in the battle against extinction."
Feld Entertainment has 54 Asian elephants, 19 which travel and perform and 35 which live at the company's 200-acre conservatory in Florida. The newest, born a few minutes before Inauguration day, was named Barack after the new president and was the first conceived by artificial insemination. www.msnbc.msn.com/id/29020334/?gt1=43001 |
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Post by Queen of the Damned on Feb 9, 2009 19:52:59 GMT -5
I really don't know which side to side with here. Yes, just because I am a woman, doesn't mean I'm going to get all teary eyed and believe all these animals are treated bad, nor am I on the side of the circus who says the animals are all brimming ear to ear.
So, who do I side with? Good question. I think, I will stay neutral. Circus's and Elephants go together like peanut butter and jelly. You really can't have one with out the other. I'd say as long as regular inspections are done and everything is fine, then, wheres the problem? Kids love the circus, they love the elephants, if the elephants were that miserable, wouldn't you be able to tell anyway?
I say, go to the circus, have some popcorn and cotton candy, watch the clowns, the elephants, and all the acts, laugh, and have a great time.
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Post by b_Pooly on Feb 9, 2009 19:59:43 GMT -5
I've heard of there being cruelty to the elephants some times, but never constantly. I just treat it like people mistreating their pets....
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Post by BigFaker on Feb 9, 2009 20:06:31 GMT -5
They still have circus' with animals like elephants!?
I'm pretty sure all that stuff was banned over here, the circus over here is all about the humans talents from what I've seen. Contortion, agility etc.
I'd be more inclined to lean towards the activists on this one.
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Post by Queen of the Damned on Feb 9, 2009 20:16:30 GMT -5
They still have circus' with animals like elephants!? I'm pretty sure all that stuff was banned over here, the circus over here is all about the humans talents from what I've seen. Contortion, agility etc. I'd be more inclined to lean towards the activists on this one. IDK, I didn't think the elephants had a problem with it. It would be so much easier if the animals spoke English, heck, even French or Spanish, then we would have no debates ! |
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Post by b_Pooly on Feb 9, 2009 20:25:36 GMT -5
They still have circus' with animals like elephants!? I'm pretty sure all that stuff was banned over here, the circus over here is all about the humans talents from what I've seen. Contortion, agility etc. I'd be more inclined to lean towards the activists on this one. IDK, I didn't think the elephants had a problem with it. It would be so much easier if the animals spoke English, heck, even French or Spanish, then we would have no debates ! now she wants to see animals talking? What is this, the Jungle Book? Just wait for the elephants to rampage through the crowd, clear cut sign right there. |
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Post by hypercringe on Feb 11, 2009 0:15:55 GMT -5
The use of male elephants in a circus is banned as even a well treated bull can fly off the deep end for no reason.
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Post by b_Pooly on Feb 11, 2009 6:31:15 GMT -5
That's just being sexist.... everyone always got to be hating on the dude.
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Post by BigFaker on Feb 11, 2009 8:26:38 GMT -5
That's just being sexist.... everyone always got to be hating on the dude. Even God apparently. Did you know Women don't suffer from haemophilia, they just carry it and pass it on to their sons and grandsons. |
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Post by hypercringe on Feb 11, 2009 8:41:44 GMT -5
That's just being sexist.... everyone always got to be hating on the dude. Even God apparently. Did you know Women don't suffer from haemophilia, they just carry it and pass it on to their sons and grandsons. Not true, women can suffer from haemophilia its just extremely rare as it requires the mother to either be a sufferer or carrier and their father to be a sufferer. Bull elephants are proun to fits of rage. Its also easier to bring down a female elephant should the need arise. |
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Post by b_Pooly on Feb 11, 2009 16:33:07 GMT -5
Even God apparently. Did you know Women don't suffer from haemophilia, they just carry it and pass it on to their sons and grandsons. Not true, women can suffer from haemophilia its just extremely rare as it requires the mother to either be a sufferer or carrier and their father to be a sufferer. Bull elephants are proun to fits of rage. Its also easier to bring down a female elephant should the need arise. You mean calling them fat makes them cry? |
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